tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post2061323334103449882..comments2024-02-19T05:18:27.849-05:00Comments on <center>the Q at Parkside</center>: Don't ShootClarkson FlatBedhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13463744536115119388noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-87112030089271388792015-05-16T04:09:08.802-04:002015-05-16T04:09:08.802-04:00Maybe it would add some significance to the art t...Maybe it would add some significance to the art to know that Sneaker King's storefront was smashed in a drive by shooting a few years ago. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-84411005647994609492015-05-10T18:25:19.492-04:002015-05-10T18:25:19.492-04:00Sounds like an all-too-typical online argument gon...Sounds like an all-too-typical online argument gone awry to me. One of the things you don't get online is an opportunity to judge what mindset someone is at when they go ballistic. One could be having a bad day, be distracted, be drunk...you just don't know. I'll bet it never would've happened in person.<br /><br />Think I know of what I speak? hah! I've been involved in too many overheated back-and-forths to mention. As someone who doesn't tend to hold resentments, I feel okay about pretty much everyone after a few hours. Even NoSlappz, who continues to send me his particular warped take on the neighborhood. He's like the white version of Kasa. I choose not to share it, because so much of it is inflammatory. But he's pretty much the only one I censor on a regular basis. If someone accuses someone of something I sometimes check its accuracy. Clarkson FlatBedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13463744536115119388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-59190001214094902912015-05-10T18:07:57.951-04:002015-05-10T18:07:57.951-04:00I am the neighbor who called out Jenny for saying ...I am the neighbor who called out Jenny for saying she 'heard gun shots on a regular basis, and a mother to a 10 year old son'.. I took offense to her saying that. I also aid if she had made that statement 10 years ago I would probably agree with her. I also said if the community is so dangerous why would she continue living in a community that could bring harm to her son. Now your reference to me been a homeowner. Yes I am a homeowner, a home I acquired by working dam hard. It was not given to me as a gift. I do not live under a rock. I also said there is violence all over New York City streets and that doesn't mean I'm making excuses for any incidents of violence in PLG. So I'm pretending PLG is safe and defending my material interest as per your post. You don't know me, stop making generalizations about me. If you want to defend Jenny, go ahead, that's your right. Jenny defended herself on the Facebook page already.cheryl on parkside avehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11013269904736517359noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-52878079790289264182015-05-10T17:12:29.796-04:002015-05-10T17:12:29.796-04:00Wow, I saw that discussion unfold and it was a bit...Wow, I saw that discussion unfold and it was a bit different than how it was described above. I will say that some people seem a bit too willing to get personal, and that was coming from diff directions. Can we just move on?ElizabethChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18316599865446371061noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-39410962128127507752015-05-09T11:34:31.659-04:002015-05-09T11:34:31.659-04:00re: the facebook discussion that is referenced her...re: the facebook discussion that is referenced here, the woman helping the artist absolutely did not attack the neighbors for their art critiques. In reality, a neighbor who apparently owns her home here, called her a liar for saying she hears guns shots, and a bad mother for saying she is a mother who worries about guns, in an open thread (I know, sounds crazy, right?) and that personal mean stuff was mingled into a thread about not liking the art. It was all Lord of the Flies. I don't blame the woman who helped the artist for anything she said after that, coming from a place of being hurt by some low blows - if you poke anyone in the eye with a stick enough at some point they will poke back in defense too. EVERYONE needs to back off. I have the perception that the neighbors who said awful things about Jenny were defending their material interests as home owners in having the neighborhood be perceived as safe; whereas, Jenny was defending against personal attacks and being called ridiculous things. It isn't the same. Geesh. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-74850333881561498092015-05-08T22:59:37.735-04:002015-05-08T22:59:37.735-04:00What RoxV said. "Good art means the message i...What RoxV said. "Good art means the message is communicated effectively". This is not good art. I kind of think of this as a first try/study towards something better. This is the sketch you make before doing 30 more sketches, long before you put paint to metal.<br /><br />However I am gonna be fair and say this now meets one of my qualifications for art: getting a rise out of people. But I do think for the wrong reasons. (BTW I have not seen the Facebook post, I'm just commenting purely on seeing the mural)<br /><br />I have no problem with the message. My critique is with the execution.<br /><br />You want to see a successful piece of art that speaks about police violence, look at images of Sophia Dawson's mural at Ideal Glass ("Every Mother's Son"). That to me is a well thought out and well executed piece of art.jessicahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13750575000897663576noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-69957584714996921722015-05-08T14:15:12.473-04:002015-05-08T14:15:12.473-04:00Don't like the art. Agree that its low hanging...Don't like the art. Agree that its low hanging fruit, but its the sneaker shop, so it works. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14465765368986576588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-47089447895998290162015-05-08T12:53:00.314-04:002015-05-08T12:53:00.314-04:00Are you aware that "soliciting input" is...Are you aware that "soliciting input" is often merely a form of advertising?<br /><br />Ditto with crown funding websites: The goal is often free advertising, as opposed to actual donations.<br /><br />MikeFhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12947132324744364565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-88925258499440641022015-05-08T10:57:43.469-04:002015-05-08T10:57:43.469-04:00also, i think the reason a lot of other people are...also, i think the reason a lot of other people are upset (not me--i didn't participate in the conversation until i saw it made and felt it was weak) is because jenny came to the FB group and asked for their input. this gave a false illusion that the artist actually cared what the residents had to say, or that it would be some sort of a community effort. me, i wouldn't have said a damn word. i make enough art that has to be approved by committee on a daily basis; it's exhaustingroxvhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15915617906644932653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-32744653355721898672015-05-08T10:54:11.047-04:002015-05-08T10:54:11.047-04:00of course i think it matters whether it's good...of course i think it matters whether it's good art. good art does not simply mean "it's pretty." good art means the message is communicated effectively. i don't think this is.<br /><br />and for the record i make art for a living. it's the only thing i know how to do, and my only means of survival. of course it's important.roxvhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15915617906644932653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-48659388316934436222015-05-08T10:49:51.266-04:002015-05-08T10:49:51.266-04:00Sorry Anon 3:58, I never said I hated the piece. I...Sorry Anon 3:58, I never said I hated the piece. I'm pretty indifferent to it in fact. As I've said again and again I found the way it was presented as an art project about the neighborhood to be deceptive and the organizer's reaction to peoples' expressions of disappointment to be extremely unwarranted. To violently personally attack someone for expressing an opinion about a work of art (or not) is ridiculous. And the mural's creation, by the organizer's own account, was sparked not by police violence, but by civilian shootouts in the area, although it was also certainly informed by those events as well. As such, I'd say the work is about much more than just this neighborhood. Gun violence is a huge problem all over the country, and in many places, much more so than here in PLG. A mural that was truly about this neighborhood would have been different.babshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08365488181982105888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-65424614889986566962015-05-08T10:19:57.943-04:002015-05-08T10:19:57.943-04:00"get all MTOPP on…."
A new PLG (or Leff..."get all MTOPP on…."<br /><br />A new PLG (or Lefferts, if you prefer) phrase.Bob Marvinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12734112800580467028noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-83144216247663712122015-05-07T19:48:39.952-04:002015-05-07T19:48:39.952-04:00I don't think it matters a hoot whether this i...I don't think it matters a hoot whether this is good or bad art from an aesthetic perspective. It's hardly the point. You don't spray paint "Don't Shoot" in giant letters and expect people to say "i love your subtle use of blah blah blah." There's nothing subtle or particularly accomplished about the graffiti, and that's clearly intentional. CASH4 chooses words and images that fit a story and you could go and argue that it's purely youthful hubris or whatever and I'd get bored really fast.<br /><br />Where I'm not getting bored is listening to everyone (myself included) play their parts to a T. Enraged, offended, frustrated, energized, disappointed...<br /><br />One thread though that strikes me is the extraordinary ability of people to suspend reality and pretend that we - not just the neighborhood, but the whole country - haven't reached a point of supreme crisis. As the rich tower over us all, pulling the levers of power and devouring more money than God could have dreamt up, we're frightened of losing what little turf we have and allowing Law and Order take care of the mess of the underclass by any means necessary. It's easy to forget that the police are us. In this country, they're supposed to serve and protect, but always with the Constitution as a guide. That isn't happening, clearly.<br /><br />I've lived here long enough to remember at least two, sometimes five, chilling shootings on the Flabenue each year, often right around the very spot of this gate. Granted, it was WAY worse just a decade before I got here in 2003, but it was WAY worse all over. Bushwick? Craaaazy crime. This graffiti stirs people out of their dream that it will all just go away - the menacing, the uncivilized behavior, the fear that's either real and not. If this "piece" were hanging on a wall in a gallery the aesthetic arguments might resonate to me. But not here. <br /><br />It's also making painfully clear what most of us know but rarely acknowledge. That white people can safely walk in and out of these neighborhoods or conversations without the very real fear of being taken down unjustly for looking at someone the wrong way. Remember how you felt when OJ got off? Are you black, or are you white? Almost the exact same number of whites (72%) felt he was guilty as blacks (71%) felt he was innocent. In more recent shootings and killings, similarly different opinions exist for whether victims were "asking for it" or were framed or lied about. Planting evidence and guns is real, and it doesn't have to happen often for you to assume it happens all the time. Do you, white person, have any serious concern that guns or contraband might be placed on you so you can take a fall and save a crime?<br /><br />Watch Central Park Five if you haven't already. I think it's worth remembering whoever you are you're stuck in your ideology, and even a brash painting has trouble wedging it out of our skulls. The whole white City was prepared to lynch those kids. That is NOT an exaggeration. I was here. It was surreal. And that tribal mentality is still at play, no matter how far past it we think our society has reached.<br /><br />Not all of that has anything to do with Murphy's spraypaint. But I'll be damned if it didn't snap me out of my own warped ideology for long enough to recognize how screwed up we ALL are on this. It leaves no one untouched.Clarkson FlatBedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13463744536115119388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-8940869166166873112015-05-07T19:11:31.950-04:002015-05-07T19:11:31.950-04:003:58 clearly knows neither Jessica or Babs. Hearin...3:58 clearly knows neither Jessica or Babs. Hearing the organizer insulted neighbors who didn't like it, that loses me right there. I've had enough of that in this neighborhood, seriously. People who get all MTOPP on their neighbors cease to exist to me. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-18875472140673875662015-05-07T16:25:05.074-04:002015-05-07T16:25:05.074-04:00great post! thank you! if anyone is interested in ...great post! thank you! if anyone is interested in russell's artwork, let me know. :)jennynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-63276633644157794852015-05-07T15:58:24.490-04:002015-05-07T15:58:24.490-04:00The real reason your regulars (Babs, Jessica, et a...The real reason your regulars (Babs, Jessica, et al) hate this is because they don't want to be reminded of what the rest of us have to face every damn day: police violence. <br /><br />That's "divisive," or whatever, right?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-23481278460283962802015-05-07T15:52:29.848-04:002015-05-07T15:52:29.848-04:00My vote = missed opportunity, could've done so...My vote = missed opportunity, could've done something more creative. However, it is stirring the conversation pot, which is good.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-1458050393598114512015-05-07T13:11:54.248-04:002015-05-07T13:11:54.248-04:00Bob, see my post above. I think that's what re...Bob, see my post above. I think that's what really set people off - they were expecting something completely different, based on the tone of the initial inquiry on FB. It didn't help that the organizer (Jenny Ulloa) then went uncharacteristically ballistic and started violently and really inappropriately insulting anyone who'd had the temerity to say anything bad about the piece. Artists are usually used to criticism (and I doubt CASH4 is losing any sleep over anyone's comments), Ms. Ulloa apparently not so much.babshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08365488181982105888noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-57624988778725884962015-05-07T12:09:43.081-04:002015-05-07T12:09:43.081-04:00We aren't being down on the neighborhood or un...We aren't being down on the neighborhood or unsympathetic about the subject matter if we don't like the art. That's obvious in the comments here. And obvious in general.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-75981216060278036032015-05-07T10:48:56.573-04:002015-05-07T10:48:56.573-04:00The obvious answer to ALL of Anon. 4:42's ques...The obvious answer to ALL of Anon. 4:42's questions about this mural is "yes" which is what I like most about the piece.Bob Marvinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12734112800580467028noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-6195373766295468482015-05-07T10:45:39.355-04:002015-05-07T10:45:39.355-04:00Anon 10:42. You forgot a great one...P.O.'s te...Anon 10:42. You forgot a great one...P.O.'s telling the folks hanging around an arrest not to shoot pictures.Clarkson FlatBedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13463744536115119388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-44302238952923927092015-05-07T10:43:29.011-04:002015-05-07T10:43:29.011-04:00I don't understand the negativity about this m...I don't understand the negativity about this mural (mostly on the PLG & Bklyn Friends Facebook page). The mural was obviously intended to stimulate discussion, which it's done. I've been a PLG-booster for MANY years and generally prefer positive publicity, but the "Don't Shoot" text is an obvious reference to an important national topic and, while it can be read many ways, isn't a necessarily negative statement about our neighborhood. <br /><br />Do I like this mural as much as the ones I was project director for with PLG Arts? Not really, but that doesn't make it bad art by any means.Bob Marvinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12734112800580467028noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-85145493304296838402015-05-07T10:42:02.630-04:002015-05-07T10:42:02.630-04:00Is it a community plea to police officers? To each...Is it a community plea to police officers? To each other? White folks finger wagging at black kids? Black folks finger wagging at black kids? All folks finger wagging at all kids? So many questions.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-49133046736279371992015-05-07T10:21:16.083-04:002015-05-07T10:21:16.083-04:00Originality of thought or in execution is rewarded...Originality of thought or in execution is rewarded in art. So painting a popular slogan about violence in letters that appear to be bleeding just seems very lazy... he'd probably get a C in Graphic Design 101.<br /><br />Still, unlike 98% of graffiti, at least it says SOMETHING. Something other than "I [tag/glyph/initials] was here and defaced your [wall/storefront/mailbox/overpass] and there isn't a damn thing you can do about it." Maybe that was a provocative artisitic statement for the first handful of writers in the 70s but since then—it's just imitative crap by selfish, talentless morons.<br />diaknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1541468051247516447.post-58876894397166487532015-05-07T09:32:14.886-04:002015-05-07T09:32:14.886-04:00And I mean the mural. The paintings are pretty gre...And I mean the mural. The paintings are pretty great. Paul Gallowayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03275925044525881962noreply@blogger.com